Cool Discovery - Factory Hard-Top Defroster Functions on Non-Heated Tops

machoheadgames

Certified YJ Researcher
Supporting Member
Joined
May 19, 2020
Messages
2,014
Location
Dallas, TX
Most all YJs that had hardtops came with a dome light, a wiper, and a washer sprayer.

The early ones 87-89 I believe did not get the wiper or sprayer but some of them had an optional defrost on the upper models like the Sahara. They should have all had the dome light I’m pretty sure.

1990 got the wiper option but as far as I’m aware, no sprayer and the wiper arm is very different from 91-95.

1991-1995 got the new wiper and washer standard, they still had the dome light, and the defroster was optional. Pretty much only Saharas and Renegades got that option. Maybe the 95 Rio Grande but I’m not sure.

I have a 1994 original hardtop, wipe/wash, no defrost. I’ve been looking into adding defrost just because. It’s cool, why wouldn’t I want it? The factory service manual showed that only 7 wires are needed to operate all the functions. Sure enough, my top had all 7 wires! So I got to digging to see if maybe the defroster wires are hiding in my hardtop.

Above the lift gate mounts are some little holes, covered by black plastic caps. I pulled off the caps and started on the passenger side. Sure enough I saw a black wire in there and fished it out with a screwdriver. Crazy enough, it was the unused ground wire for a hardtop defroster.

I went to the other side and did not see the wire. I pulled off the dome light so I could grab the wiring harness from above and pull on it some. It’s pretty loose in the hardtop and moved easily. After pulling a few inches, the brown defroster power showed itself in the hole I uncovered. I pulled it out. Sweet, my top can easily be converted to defrost!

The way the defroster activates is the defrost tops have special liftgate struts with metal tabs on them. The wires come out of the top near the liftgate strut mount, and clip to the top of
the liftgate strut. The liftgate struts provide continuity down to the bottom of the struts where there is another tab on each. The wires from the glass connect to the strut tabs at the bottom.

Note: for this to actually work, you need a rear liftgate glass with the heater built in (the black lines), you need the factory switch to go on the dash, and you need the factory defrost harness with the red timer relay. I am buying the harness off of eBay and I will buy a piece of PPR heated glass later.

I just think this is really cool that the wiring is there. I thought surely if they don’t give you the tub harness, then they’d skimp on the wiring in the top too. Guess not. So now I can just buy parts and have a heated top. And the bonus is that now I will finally fill all 3 switches under the steering column. I like the “complete” look.

Passenger Side Wire

E8247CBB-4EA0-4FFF-B8EA-053592050604.jpeg


Driver Side Wire

2961D5F0-6E60-4841-9CAF-ECC35FBA9809.jpeg


Switch Panel with Defrost Added - I Will have the stock fog light switch in there too

1AC5EB13-3218-4CB7-9A7A-ADAA6CC1DC67.jpeg


Picture of the harness needed - can get from eBay. This harness runs from the dash, alongside the driver side, down to the driver tail light, across/above the gas tank and to the passenger tail light. I don’t feel like running all of that, so I bought this and will just remove the heated aspects of it and integrate them to my stock harness.

2D1DA967-4900-41A3-82FD-2F513D7DAEBD.jpeg
 
Whats your ETA to the YJ hitting the road? Been a long road of rebuilding that bugger.
It has been a while. I haven't worked on it lately as I've been messing with the truck. What I'm working on currently is integrating a few items into my dash harness. I finally found the dash harness off eBay that I want which means a bit of starting over but a better place to start from. I'm going to work on that in my living room, get it all done and then I should be able to pretty quickly put it into the jeep and start piecing the dash back together. After that, clean up the interior, lay out the carpet, do a bit of brake bleeding and some other minor stuff and then I should be able to hit the road.

Stuff like this post is mainly things I can do quickly as I piece back together. Like buying and hooking up the defrost work is barely anything, so it makes sense to go ahead and do it now while the dash is apart.
 
Most all YJs that had hardtops came with a dome light, a wiper, and a washer sprayer.

The early ones 87-89 I believe did not get the wiper or sprayer but some of them had an optional defrost on the upper models like the Sahara. They should have all had the dome light I’m pretty sure.

1990 got the wiper option but as far as I’m aware, no sprayer and the wiper arm is very different from 91-95.

1991-1995 got the new wiper and washer standard, they still had the dome light, and the defroster was optional. Pretty much only Saharas and Renegades got that option. Maybe the 95 Rio Grande but I’m not sure.

I have a 1994 original hardtop, wipe/wash, no defrost. I’ve been looking into adding defrost just because. It’s cool, why wouldn’t I want it? The factory service manual showed that only 7 wires are needed to operate all the functions. Sure enough, my top had all 7 wires! So I got to digging to see if maybe the defroster wires are hiding in my hardtop.

Above the lift gate mounts are some little holes, covered by black plastic caps. I pulled off the caps and started on the passenger side. Sure enough I saw a black wire in there and fished it out with a screwdriver. Crazy enough, it was the unused ground wire for a hardtop defroster.

I went to the other side and did not see the wire. I pulled off the dome light so I could grab the wiring harness from above and pull on it some. It’s pretty loose in the hardtop and moved easily. After pulling a few inches, the brown defroster power showed itself in the hole I uncovered. I pulled it out. Sweet, my top can easily be converted to defrost!

The way the defroster activates is the defrost tops have special liftgate struts with metal tabs on them. The wires come out of the top near the liftgate strut mount, and clip to the top of
the liftgate strut. The liftgate struts provide continuity down to the bottom of the struts where there is another tab on each. The wires from the glass connect to the strut tabs at the bottom.

Note: for this to actually work, you need a rear liftgate glass with the heater built in (the black lines), you need the factory switch to go on the dash, and you need the factory defrost harness with the red timer relay. I am buying the harness off of eBay and I will buy a piece of PPR heated glass later.

I just think this is really cool that the wiring is there. I thought surely if they don’t give you the tub harness, then they’d skimp on the wiring in the top too. Guess not. So now I can just buy parts and have a heated top. And the bonus is that now I will finally fill all 3 switches under the steering column. I like the “complete” look.

Passenger Side Wire

View attachment 119282

Driver Side Wire

View attachment 119283

Switch Panel with Defrost Added - I Will have the stock fog light switch in there too

View attachment 119284

Picture of the harness needed - can get from eBay. This harness runs from the dash, alongside the driver side, down to the driver tail light, across/above the gas tank and to the passenger tail light. I don’t feel like running all of that, so I bought this and will just remove the heated aspects of it and integrate them to my stock harness.

View attachment 119285
I have all you mentioned but no dome light. Where should it be located? Maybe got covered of removed by sound bar?
 
I have all you mentioned but no dome light. Where should it be located? Maybe got covered of removed by sound bar?
It's up in the back of the hardtop above the liftgate. You have no light or housing up there? It's a rectangular tannish colored housing with a bulb in it. Comes on when one of the doors is opened.
 
Great post Thanks! I bought a true YJ hardtop last year and it has the wiper, squirter, and dome light but is not heated. The holes are plugged over like you said. I still have the window sticker from the dealer and the YJ was sold with a soft top, hence no wire plug on the harness which runs along the right side.

The dome light would be nice. I need door uppers or full doors first before I can enjoy driving in the rain. Look like there might be a different washer reservoir with two pumps up front needed to get the squirter working unless a two-way pump can be added.

The original top owner took it off her YJ back in '93 and put it under a tarp as did the next owner. I guess I should check to see if the wiper even works before going any further.

Used wire harness $$$ yikes!
 
  • Like
Reactions: machoheadgames
Great post Thanks! I bought a true YJ hardtop last year and it has the wiper, squirter, and dome light but is not heated. The holes are plugged over like you said. I still have the window sticker from the dealer and the YJ was sold with a soft top, hence no wire plug on the harness which runs along the right side.

The dome light would be nice. I need door uppers or full doors first before I can enjoy driving in the rain. Look like there might be a different washer reservoir with two pumps up front needed to get the squirter working unless a two-way pump can be added.

The original top owner took it off her YJ back in '93 and put it under a tarp as did the next owner. I guess I should check to see if the wiper even works before going any further.

Used wire harness $$$ yikes!
Yeah it’s some work getting an original soft top Jeep to accept a hardtop and do all the functions. You’ll need the dual squirter tank, and also i guess the extra sprayer itself. For whatever reason the hardtop sprayer is different from the windshield one. Not sure if the wiring is on there for the extra sprayer. It probably is, most front lighting harnesses I’ve seen have both plugs on them.

The harness for the tub to top is about $80. Kind of a lot, but not all that terrible when you consider what it’s doing for you. You will need to drop the tank and pull the whole harness up through the tub hole and replace with the eBay one ideally. For me it’s no big deal to add the few applicable wires to do the defrost, but since you are missing all the hardtop wires, makes more sense to run the eBay harness and just make small repairs to it if needed.
 
Those reasons are why I haven't put much time into it yet. A quick eBay search for the full harness showed around $200 but again I didn't spend much time on it. My current harness has 5 wires which I figure are for the fuel pump, sending unit, turn and running lights and the ground.

I changed out the struts for the back windows not long ago and didn't notice any wire connection tabs but since I don't have the heated window it makes sense not to have them.

Just ran out and checked the old struts and no connector tabs. I see the window does have a squirter built in just below the wiper motor drive and there is a hose connection next to the wire harness connector in the back right corner.

1.jpg


2.jpg
 
Those reasons are why I haven't put much time into it yet. A quick eBay search for the full harness showed around $200 but again I didn't spend much time on it. My current harness has 5 wires which I figure are for the fuel pump, sending unit, turn and running lights and the ground.

I changed out the struts for the back windows not long ago and didn't notice any wire connection tabs but since I don't have the heated window it makes sense not to have them.

Just ran out and checked the old struts and no connector tabs. I see the window does have a squirter built in just below the wiper motor drive and there is a hose connection next to the wire harness connector in the back right corner.

View attachment 119286

View attachment 119287
If you pulled the connector out of the top a bit, how many terminal slots are occupied?

The full harness you need honestly should only be about $80 via dead Jeep. If you want the one to activate the heater then you need the one that has the red relay in the picture. Pretty certain wipe/wash harnesses are cheaper because they’re way more readily available. The two connectors just plug in above the parking brake and then run down the length of the tub to the top and then down to the tail lamps.

You’d have to confirm but I’m pretty sure the defrost switch plug and wiper/washer plugs are already chillin out behind your panel at the 5:00 steering wheel location. It was standard to make all the 92-95 dash harnesses the same except for fog light capability.

You definitely have the same standard top I have, with wipe and wash. I expect your defrost wires are in there.

As for the struts, yeah I actually didn’t know about those either. When I got my YJ in 2013 the stock struts were dead. I pulled the hardtop and didn’t run it for many years so I never changed them. Randomly one day I was buying something at RockAuto and added some struts to the cart. It didn’t say defrost or anything in the description, yet they were just on there. So I kind of just lucked out that I got the heater ones. My originals had no tab.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Flyer58
If you pulled the connector out of the top a bit, how many terminal slots are occupied?

The full harness you need honestly should only be about $80 via dead Jeep. If you want the one to activate the heater then you need the one that has the red relay in the picture. Pretty certain wipe/wash harnesses are cheaper because they’re way more readily available. The two connectors just plug in above the parking brake and then run down the length of the tub to the top and then down to the tail lamps.

You’d have to confirm but I’m pretty sure the defrost switch plug and wiper/washer plugs are already chillin out behind your panel at the 5:00 steering wheel location. It was standard to make all the 92-95 dash harnesses the same except for fog light capability.

You definitely have the same standard top I have, with wipe and wash. I expect your defrost wires are in there.

As for the struts, yeah I actually didn’t know about those either. When I got my YJ in 2013 the stock struts were dead. I pulled the hardtop and didn’t run it for many years so I never changed them. Randomly one day I was buying something at RockAuto and added some struts to the cart. It didn’t say defrost or anything in the description, yet they were just on there. So I kind of just lucked out that I got the heater ones. My originals had no tab.
I pulled the connector and found 7 wires occupying 6 connectors, one is shared.

I didn't bother cleaning them to check the colors. I also located the big plug by the E-Brake for all wires going back but didn't dig around for the others. I bet they are there.

1.jpg


2.jpg
 
I pulled the connector and found 7 wires occupying 6 connectors, one is shared.

I didn't bother cleaning them to check the colors. I also located the big plug by the E-Brake for all wires going back but didn't dig around for the others. I bet they are there.

View attachment 119289

View attachment 119290
Your hardtop wiring looks a bit different than mine color wise although you do have the two heater wires. Whenever you want to dive in down the road we can compare what we’ve got to make sure yours will all work. Mine is occupying 7 spots if I’m remembering right, although I definitely have two wires spliced into one, so I thought that meant I have 8 wires. I’ll have to look again.

Ok so you found that big black plug, there should be a gray one up there, unless Jeep skimped on the dash harness for soft top Jeeps…in that case then yeah you would need another dash harness because you’d be missing the switch connectors. But maybe you’ll find the gray plug taped up up there when you dig more. Hopefully so. If not, then yeah getting the top working will be a bit more expensive because it’s another harness you need. They are available at least. If you spend some extra you could even get the fancy Sahara/renegade dash harness that supports fog lights. Granted your front lighting harness would need to be changed to match that to support them. And you’d need a fog switch.

But, good news is there are plenty of heated hardtop, wiper/washer hardtop dash harnesses that do NOT support fogs so if you don’t care about that, you should be able to find something 92-95 easy.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Flyer58
Whats your ETA to the YJ hitting the road? Been a long road of rebuilding that bugger.
Update on this. My factory dash harness that I’ve been customizing for a while has been put on hold. And by customizing, I mean creating a bunch of circuits and relays for my switch panel powered off of unused stock wires that I repurposed.

The stock harness with fog light function I bought off eBay came today and is almost pristine. Super impressive for the age. I need to do two things to it which is setup the heater bulb for LED (dimmed with a resistor) and I need to wire in the extended 4-5 wires for my stereo in the Tuffy console. Those are in progress. After that I’m going to install into the Jeep and get this thing on the road in stock form.

I’ve decided that I will save all the customizing for when I do a custom dash and do it all at once. That’s when I’ll really need to do a bunch of wiring work, so I will do that all at once. Plus, I can drive on this harness while I prep the original for the custom dash later.

So with that said, I need to bleed the brakes, clean up some under hood wiring, install dash harness, clean up interior and finish the carpet, and I’m basically good to go.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Flyer58
Bought a factory defroster harness which was in pretty nasty shape but included the special red relay I needed, and the wires and their appropriate terminals to install in my own factory connectors. It was pretty simple to do, just took some time. I now have 12V at the defroster wire when I trigger the defrosted with my factory eBay switch :cool:

The harness says it came out of a 1994, but man it was a mess. It DID come out of a 1994-1995, because the wiring for 3rd brake light was there. All the connectors were there just fine, but the wiring colors were all screwed up. Some solid colors, some colors were factory for positive but were put in the grounds, etc. it was a mess. It was definitely factory though, not tinkered with. It’s like Jeep ran out of wire that day and went to the parts store and bought a roll of every color lol. It made it a nightmare to get wired up, I had to triple check every wire function to figure out what goes where.

I wish I took pics but in the moment I was working through it and didn’t really. All I can say is that the conversion is quite easy if one desires to do it! Now I just need the heated glass, assemble it and I will officially have the factory hardtop heater option.

The relay I received was not working. It triggered on and off properly and the timer worked, but I was not getting continuity from battery power out to the defroster itself. It was an easy fix. Opened the relay and saw the armature was not contacting the output terminal when triggered. It was bent slightly out of shape, so I just bent it back. In the bottom right you can see the two contacts, when relay triggers those are supposed to touch. They weren’t. After bending the arm it works perfectly now. I had purchased another relay from eBay, which worked as it came. So now I have a spare!

6C39E632-9DBC-4F85-8255-31F5836CF2F8.jpeg
 
  • Like
Reactions: Flyer58
Good deal and great repair. I wonder why they bent to begin with. Sounds like a Lucas electric product.
Yeah I’m not sure how/why the armature was not making contact. It did not look damaged. Funny enough it looks damaged now that I deliberately bent it. But at least it works.

I wanted to take apart the working relay and see what it’s like but they don’t close back up as well once you open them. So I’m leaving it alone. As long as the one I fixed works, then I don’t really care. Not sure who makes the relay actually.

I’m just glad it’s done, just need the glass. I was thinking the wiring work would be more of a pain than it was. Now it’s done.