5 volts TPS

[CurtT]

Hello I'm new here. I have a 95 YJ with 2.5 manual transmission. i have some issue with backfires and stuttering (ECU was replaced and all good). I'm currently getting 4.85/5 volts to my TPS sensor which has been replaced as well. I can't figure out where the voltages jump is coming from and looking for some help.

I understand at ACC the voltage should be around .35 +/- and gradually go up as throttle increases not mine, the TPS starts around 5V and moves to 5.08/5.10V.

I know I've read somewhere on this page about this but can't seem to find the post anymore. if anyone can assist, I would be grateful.

 

[deadpool1]

REDUX, IT SEEMS BACKFIRE IS NOT CORRECT AND IS ACTUALLY MISFIRE. ( but I can't here it so... but he now says misfire)
The evidence of all starting, idling and driving conditions not told, what engine does hot and cold. ( sure misfires we think)
let me focus on only the TPS, well it does not cause backfire or misfire. but...
here is what the TPS does. and not do.

the TPS is only a carbon variable resistor (no electronics here just a pure electric device,)
The ground pin dead, cut wire or rusty pin, makes the CEL glow and DTC sets code #24, flash flash, pause flash flash flash flash, (code 55 means end of communications.

if the wire is cut #1 GND, the engine will not start, because pin2 is falsly at 5v, and 5v means in fact 4.5, to 5.5vdc, each car is unique voltage here in this spec range) each ECU is unique narrow voltage range.

with pin 2, at 5v the PCM goes to cut fuel mode (AKA unflood ) mode and no fuel injections happen to clear flooded engine, this word means spark plugs are dripping in raw fuel now, so this is a features in all cars to clear floods.
the flooded spark plug is now a short circuit to the HV spark of it carbon fouls fast. 100 years now same deal. failing.

failure mode 2, pin 2 wire cut or just rusty as many are 30 years later. (no surprise here)
the CEL glows, and code #24 hits again for dead pin2, it sees the pin DOA totally dead. and knows it is and tells you it was.
the pin 3 is is cut or pins rusty etc, power is not lost to the TPS, all power 5vdc is lost and again code 24 told you the TPS is 100% DOA. dead.
oops forgot to say, DTC 24 puts the EFI in LIMPHOME mode.
and then simulates the dead TPS, using a ECU virutal TPS emulated via RPM map sensor data. and goes very rich.
I told you not to ignore the CEL lamp as that act fails for you to know engine EFI is stuck in limp home mode.
The MAP dead the same magic happens it is simulated MAP (using RPM and TPS data)
OBD1 and OBD2 both do this magic, so the car at the least lets you drive to a shop, and not stuck in a snow bank freezing to death, .


now the last failure mode, we have all seen sense, 1980 up. USA TBI or MPI , EFI engines electronic fuel injected engine , any

TPS can wear out. yes the carbon on the TPS is worn out and causes TIP in engine power hesitation.
in fact pin 2 glictches. ( in electroncs we all this a bogus voltage transient )
the effect is simple the driver move his/her right toe to go faster at any speed even 0 mph up. and the engine bogs (i say) or other say it hesitates
then after a 1 to 3 second delay FULL NORMAL POWER HITS THE REAR WHEELS. because the MAP sensor now corrects the LIES told by the TPS on your engine. yours is new so is not going to happen (wires good)
The other errors is not reading the FSM to see how to install a New TPS, and not indexing it as it states.
if done wrong you will get errors. hesitation or code 24's

the TPS has one more job, as you drive say fast in gear and the release that right off fast and now the engine goes to engine compression braking mode
like big diesel truck and a virtual JAKE BRAKE.
the TPS SEES THAT THE pcm CUTS FUEL FULLY. (WHY WASTE FUEL TO COAST IN GEAR SLOWER, WELL IT DOES NOT.
The EFI system also may open the idle air controller (IAC) a tad to keep the poor driver neck from snapping, (yes even dumB ecu are this smart)

The TPS is only a throttle angle sensor (ASE modern name) and varies as the FSM states 1 to 4vdc the output pin
in direct linear relationship to throttle angle real.

TPS POWER PIN:
page 14-47 shows 5vdc is actually 4.5 to 5.5v or 5v plus or minus 0.5 volts. this the spec. and 100% normal. (+/- 10% spec) it is not precision at all ,see?
The ECU creates 5vdc from the 12vdc battery power pins to the ECU the ECU has on board a 5vdc crude regulator.
I have even repaired many ECU with +5vdc pin dead. ( a bad zener diode in most cases and is cheap one, 10% not the 5%.

now my point , your TPS is new, and is working correctly if indexed by the book and no code 24 DTC errors present.
IT DOES NOT CAUSE MISFIRE!
if the engine actually misfires at woT wide open throttle we, then diagnose that and forget the TPS fully now.
(pulled neg lug battery) new TPS, , battery neg lug back and key on TPS autocals. and works and no more code 24.
the ECU battery is hot all the time so pulling the battery neg lug erased ECU DTC memory of all old stored DTC errors.
DTC, diagnostc trouble codes are errors , never ignore errors, reset them drive and see if they come back is the rule.
I don't make the rules it's all in the ECU firmware .

please tell running evidences running the engine hot /cold fast, and for sure WOT> does it misfire at WOT or not in any gear fast.
95 fsm page chapter 8w, 2.5L only

this is all there is, for TPS, it is a very simple device, and most times is OKAY jeep then calls is only signal. this is throttle angle as told today. This is output to ECU. this pin2

 

[CurtT]

Thank you for your help. The voltage jump was at the TPS censor when i had jeep in ACC. i manually moved the throttle while testing the input and output of the TPS and that's where i would get the voltage jump starting at 5V to 5.10 +/- at the TPS. the stuttering/backfire never happened before the TPS high voltage showed up.

I did find the grounds for all the censor's and the factory connections looks bad so was going to start there and see if there's any bad connections.

I will review and get back to you. back at it tonight after work.

 

[CurtT]

thanks for help. let me see if i can type this correctly, (not much of mechanic but can figure things out).

its not much of a back fire as a hesitation/studder (backfire might not have been proper term sorry). ive done all the test from Chrysler with Ecu and censors and this is what ive got.

1. TPS @ ACC 4.8
2. ASE (middle pin) @ ACC 4.8

Im getting high voltage to the TPS censor at all times. Ive cleaned all my grounds to the motor and and traced back the ground and TPS supply line and ASE line to make sure i have no cross over in voltage; ie. crossed/frayed wire. the hesitation (what i was calling back fire) has to be because of the high voltage to TPS so that im not worried about.

Im at a loss. if im making any sense or if you need any clarification let me know. not the best mechanic..

thanks for help

 

[CurtT]

Thanks for your help. ill check this out tonight/tomorrow and will get back to you.

 

[CurtT]

I did notice that my thermostat is reading 0 right now. which is new. that ia have a new thermostat and will replace. would that have anything to do with? just asking..

 

[deadpool1]

no hurry take your time , and most time these old cars fail for bad wiring, (by corrosion or abused this old , it happens)
but now the 20 question list. sorry EFI is complex, and answers are based on tests done and change as tests results are told
does engine crank fast, yes (we keep the battery fully charged if engine can not run)
does engine start?, if not use 5% throttle to hide the dead IAC valve bad
does it start and stay running, all by it self and sustained?
does it now run only if you pump the right foot?
if it runs can it drive? or has no power
is the exh manifold lower lips drip raw fuel> and smelled,
is backfires as cranked or does it at idle, or only on aggressive rigth foot actions.
does back fire mean to the air cleaner, a not too loud, cough there or a huge tail pipe here muffler explosion that can wake the dead. (I can't hear it)
which end of the car backfires, front or rear, I can not guess.
did it just die one day out of the blue
or bought like this weak/dead /etc.?

the air cleaner backfire hints at a bad engine,in most cases. (burned intake valve or cam out of time) or spark happening at 180 degrees off time.
to the muffler explosion that is raw fuel , engine rich as a pig or flooding.

post all evidence and answers will be better.

 

[CurtT]

no hurry take your time , and most time these old cars fail for bad wiring, (by corrosion or abused this old , it happens)
but now the 20 question list. sorry EFI is complex, and answers are based on tests done and change as tests results are told
does engine crank fast, yes (we keep the battery fully charged if engine can not run)
does engine start?, if not use 5% throttle to hide the dead IAC valve bad
does it start and stay running, all by it self and sustained?
does it now run only if you pump the right foot?
if it runs can it drive? or has no power
is the exh manifold lower lips drip raw fuel> and smelled,
is backfires as cranked or does it at idle, or only on aggressive rigth foot actions.
does back fire mean to the air cleaner, a not too loud, cough there or a huge tail pipe here muffler explosion that can wake the dead. (I can't hear it)
which end of the car backfires, front or rear, I can not guess.
did it just die one day out of the blue
or bought like this weak/dead /etc.?

the air cleaner backfire hints at a bad engine,in most cases. (burned intake valve or cam out of time) or spark happening at 180 degrees off time.
to the muffler explosion that is raw fuel , engine rich as a pig or flooding.

post all evidence and answers will be better.

no problem, ill try to give you as much as i can...

1. jeep was running fine for a very long time. had off road for couple weeks and check engine light came, had a hole in muffler so was sounding great(sarcasm). as well as my alternator was making some bad squealing noises. and check engine light came on.
2. brought back home checked with computer and said i had high voltage to TPS censor.
3. I replaced alternator because of noise/ squealing.
4. checked TPS censor (which had been replaced roughly 1 year ago) and throttle as shown on Youtube video for YJ 2.5. also took throttle body off and cleaned thoroughly because was pretty dirty..
5. then had issue with my ECU which ended up not working so i purchased another ECU from a jeep wholesaler out of Daytona. replaced ECU and still had same issues as before. had to replace ECU because the computer fried and would not start the jeep at all. FYI wasn't just replacing to try and see if worked.
6. I've checked all the 5 grounds and removed and cleaned the contacts and also traced the 2 lines from the TPS back to ECU to make sure there was no cross over of voltage.
7. also pulled the pages off the chryslers books you supplied about TPS high voltage issue and repairs and went through everything multiple times. which after doing the test multiple time keeps saying to replace the ECU again..


this is where im at. getting frustrated but trying to figure out. dont like sending to mechanic and like trying to figure out, but wiring/voltage issues are a complete pain is ass!!

hope this helps..

 

[deadpool1]

I did notice that my thermostat is reading 0 right now.

using what method ? the dash meter temp does not use the 2 pin ECT sensor that the ECU uses
the dash sensor is a 1 wire rear of head
the ECU ECT sensor 2wire on the side of the thermostat housing
the gauge has zero to do with the engine EFI operation. (well if it tells the truth it can sure. it's not. )
I have real scan tool you do not have and can scan the ECT and see it hit 180f. and holds.

learn to run the engine, and feel the top rad hose and when the hand flies back you yell, ouch that is 180f hit.(a cave man test, but SOP)
or use a $15 IR heat gun to the thermostat housing and see 180f hit (see photos)
gee ask anything, all questions fully fleshed out have answers. all questions are good.



which is new. that ia have a new thermostat and will replace. would that have anything to do with? just asking..


the dash meter dead has 3 simple causes (if lucky and luck happens:
the 1 wire to the rear sensor on top left (right facing )cylinder head has fallen off. bing. (just pulling it off and back one can fix it) "RUST"
the sensor pipe threads are rusty or has silly caulk or teflon taped on it so clean it. and it works, the thread is GROUND.
DASH:
the dash display has a flex PCB there, and the meter screws there rust and fail. on almost all jeeps this old in fact
here is mine, center dash cluster , comes out easy
that is raw copper PCB.
that is now brown.or omg GREEN that means it is corroded. and even the washers there are rustly here.
solution:
I clean the copper traces, screws off, with pencil eraser gently until shinny new copper look., end. (like copper cooking pot looks cleaned) or new copper wire looks.
same reason for warning lamps bad and Illumination in park.

the 1 wire sensor last photo
the IR gun photo 2.
cold engine just idling can take 30 minutes to reach full 180f. also old thermostats can be slow or only go to 160f. or too hot, lots of failure modes.

hiding behind injector 4.

 

[CurtT]

no problem, ill try to give you as much as i can...

1. jeep was running fine for a very long time. had off road for couple weeks and check engine light came, had a hole in muffler so was sounding great(sarcasm). as well as my alternator was making some bad squealing noises. and check engine light came on.
2. brought back home checked with computer and said i had high voltage to TPS censor.
3. I replaced alternator because of noise/ squealing.
4. checked TPS censor (which had been replaced roughly 1 year ago) and throttle as shown on Youtube video for YJ 2.5. also took throttle body off and cleaned thoroughly because was pretty dirty..
5. then had issue with my ECU which ended up not working so i purchased another ECU from a jeep wholesaler out of Daytona. replaced ECU and still had same issues as before. had to replace ECU because the computer fried and would not start the jeep at all. FYI wasn't just replacing to try and see if worked.
6. I've checked all the 5 grounds and removed and cleaned the contacts and also traced the 2 lines from the TPS back to ECU to make sure there was no cross over of voltage.
7. also pulled the pages off the chryslers books you supplied about TPS high voltage issue and repairs and went through everything multiple times. which after doing the test multiple time keeps saying to replace the ECU again..


this is where im at. getting frustrated but trying to figure out. dont like sending to mechanic and like trying to figure out, but wiring/voltage issues are a complete pain is ass!!

hope this helps..

sorry forgot to say engine runs and jeep drives but hesitation/"misfire"

 

[CurtT]

I did notice that my thermostat is reading 0 right now.
using what method ? the dash meter temp does not use the ECT sensor that the ECU uses
the dash sensor is 1 wire rear of head
the ECU ECT sensor 2wire on the side of the thermostat housing
the guage has zero to do with the engine EFI operation.
I have real scan too you do not have and can scan the ECT and see it hit 180f. and hold
learn to run the engine, and fell the top rad hose and when the hand flies back you yell, ouch 180f hit.
or use a $15 IR heat gun to t he thermostat housing and see 180f hit
gee ask anything, all questions fully fleshed out have answers. all questions are good.



which is new. that ia have a new thermostat and will replace. would that have anything to do with? just asking..


the dash meter dead has 3 simple causes (if lucky and luck happens:
the 1 wire to the rear sensor on top left (right facing )cylinder head has fallen off. bing.
the sensor pipe thread is rusty or has silly caulk or teflon taped on it so clean it. and it works the thread is GROUND.
the dash display has a flex PCB there, and the meter screws there rust and fail. on almost all jeeps this old in fact
here is mine, center dash cluster , comes out easy
that is raw copper PCB.
that is now brown. that means it is corroded. and even the washers there are rustly
I clean the copper screw off, with pencil eraser gently until shinny new copper look., end.
same reason for warning lamps bad and Illumination in park.
View attachment 122535

the 1 wire sensor last photo
the IR gun photo 2.

View attachment 122536

View attachment 122537

FYI just checked jeep (drove to Work) and temp gauge was unplugged. 1 problem fixed!!!

 

[deadpool1]

oh , its only misfiring. (a whole new ball of wax as we say) so THE TPS does not cause misfire at WOT, does it misfire WOT or WOT up a hill?
misfire is hear and felt even see the shifter lever bounce, as engine shakes hard and 1 cylinder dropping out is 3 remaining and violent.
key on 3 times see the DTC 12 ?error, my wild guess gen (bearings shot) dead and battery low error DTC.12
all EFI pages on all cars made after all tests pass and still fails, it says replace the ECU and really this is wrong. vast things can cause misfire.
ECU is dead last
even 1 weak injector can fail and misfire or injector leaks.
one spark plug bad
one cylinder has weak compression (a test) or spark plugs bad , spark wires, or spark tips (out) are carbon fouled, or antifreeze drips or oil soak or fouled in any why. learn to read spark tips ( a 100 year old engine skill that is still done)

lean fuel mix and it misfires, low fuel pressure and it misfires.
or too rich fuel mix (unplug the o2 sensor and drive ) runs better now? too rich has many causes even a bad MAP sensor.

the fuel pressure is not monitored by the ECU ever , 1996 does a bit (with trim errors etc) new cars PCM does fuel pressure not yours.
Fuel pressure is 31 psi at idle, and 41 (or near) at WOT if the FPR is bad the EFI can not regulate fuel injection correctly at all. ever.
using the Fuel pressure hand PSI gauge at the fuel rail test port is the Answer.
never seen one 30 year old FPR good. not me. they fail even 15 years old.
if this car was a 1996
you'd scan it and see a ton of errors
P0300 or 301,2,3,4 300 = random misfire all 4.
and P017x errors way to lean or rich trim.
and more,

the key question (no pun) here when is does the engine misfire. (driving modes are complex, )
when matters HUGE>
all the time.? no matter what.
at idle? only?
or only at tip in throttle right foot moves and hesitates only for a 1seconds or so. (TPS causes or low fuel pressure)
or misfires too WOT.
when tells me what going on./
if the first right foot , for long time the engine lacks power even WOT, can misfire (violently) or just bogs, like dragging 1000 lb brick bind the car (lean out)

the only hard part on these old cars is not 1996 and newer
the ECU is very crude then. (lacking a real scan tool that I have) for 1995 I can even do PID scans on mine
but nobody has my tool.
that means use meters an hand gauges to find the cause.
one way to misfire is the 02 goes bad and sticks at 0volts the PCM goes max rich and misfires.
un plug the 02 sensor at the conn. and see if the now 0.45v default make fueling go better.

next time CEL sticks on do the 3 key on trick see the DTCs errors, there can be lots..

the TPS only does enrich mode. ( the ECU sees your right foot press down hard and fast)
the ECU goes to enrich mode , called Tipin- if not it bogs for a few seconds and catches up as the slow map sensor reports the new vacuum.
the TPS HAS NO BEARING on fuel mix, at WOT< floor the pedal after the tip in delay ends., and the MAP controls fuel mix not the TPS
let be be clear your towing tailer full of bricks up a hill. you must floor it(throttle) in 3rd of 4th gear. the TPS does not control fuel now
the MAP does that and if fuel pressure or the map fails it lacks any serious power,HP, but does not misfire. it bogs. only
this assumes engine is hot 180f, not 150 or missing thermostat.

this assumes spark is not failing,.
and dead cyclinders 150psi is normal . 9.1:1 compression ratio at sea level not in Denver.(less)
clogged injectors
leaking injectors.
On any car this old I never assume the engine is good , nor injectors not bad. or fouled spark plugs

Can I assume spark parts are good.
cap, rotor, HV wire set (I use mag wires from NGK or Bosch), and the plugs are gaped to hood spec and not fouled.?

 

[deadpool1]

sorry forgot to say engine runs and jeep drives but hesitation/"misfire"

the TPS is autocalibrated when the battery is connected backup after the TPS change out (step 1 is pull neg lug first to do any electric work)
this 1st step keeps from blowing a was good, $500 ECU up... (

the TPS must be indexted correclty per the page in the FSM if not the TPS is now loose and does not track the TV throttle valve shaft and will not work correctly the FSM covers the proper steps for the NEW TPS. this car ,this engine and this TPS must be installed as the book tells you , not like other cars
okay do not follow advice from youtube if the guy there cant read the book and do the index correctly.
sorry this steps is pure mechancical. and must be down correct.

I only have one question now. (sorry in 5min driving I can learn 20 things) but on a web site we can't do that.
I must ask for answers. and I will. no problem there, normal

if the TPS is indexed correctly it works, ( on the correct side of the TPS tangs.)

 

[CurtT]

the TPS is autocalibrated when the battery is connected backup after the TPS change out (step 1 is pull neg lug first to do any electric work)
this 1st step keeps from blowing a was good, $500 ECU up... (

the TPS must be indexted correclty per the page in the FSM if not the TPS is now loose and does not track the TV throttle valve shaft and will not work correctly the FSM covers the proper steps for the NEW TPS. this car ,this engine and this TPS must be installed as the book tells you , not like other cars
okay do not follow advice from youtube if the guy there cant read the book and do the index correctly.
sorry this steps is pure mechancical. and must be down correct.

I only have one question now. (sorry in 5min driving I can learn 20 things) but on a web site we can't do that.
I must ask for answers. and I will. no problem there, normal

if the TPS is indexed correctly it works, ( on the correct side of the TPS tangs.)

View attachment 122541

I will check this out tonight/ tomorrow. if this is not done as you stated, will this increase the voltage to the TPS just asking? also will the CO2 sensor have anything to do with the "mis Firing"? not getting any readings on replacing it but just asking.

 

[deadpool1]

The cause of actual misfire, for sure at WOT, not just idle , not just fast right foot for only 3 seconds ,but misfires all the time cold or hot or both
this is a mostly MACRO answer: (this time and a no guess parts and throw them answer)

• the engine is actually bad, compression test fails, or say coolant seen on spark tips.?
• Spark is bad, a full 60k tune up is not throwing parts it is listed in the 60k service points, cap/rotor/hv wire sets/ & plugs.
• EFI is bad. (the fueling side) injectors bad , 1/2 clogged or leaking. fuel pressure wrong. at idle and or WOT .
• MAP sensor bad. making ECU compute fueling wrong. for the vacuum hose to it is bad, clogged or cracked.
• ECT bad tells ECU that you live in Alaska, (reads wrong ohms for 72 degree temps before first start in the AM) FSm covers it.
• Any wiring bad to any of the above that has wires. if you still get DTC 24 the TPS is still failing for bad wires.

there are tests for each possible case using tools, meters (DMM) , fuel pressure gauge, compression gauge, etc)
more causes are CKP bad, (crank sensor is flaky , intermittent,)a gain wires.
the CMP in the Distributor , is inject to cam sync sensor, and if set wrong injections will be timed wrong and misfire it can.
The Distributor pulled then put back in now is TIMED wrong. every time. it must be done correctly ,by the book FSM (free)
95,,,,2.5L (usa spec car)

wires bad means the wire or the pins or corrosion see, cut wires smashed, wrecked, etc. or insultation missing and now shorts
other wrong things even to metal of the body or the engine, this is called damaged wires. electrics 101 stuff

I am not saying this is the only list, just top causes, (majors)

 

[CurtT]

The cause of actual misfire, for sure at WOT, not just idle , not just fast right foot for only 3 seconds ,but misfires all the time cold or hot or both
this is a mostly MACRO answer: (this time and a no guess parts and throw them answer)

• the engine is actually bad, compression test fails, or say coolant seen on spark tips.?
• Spark is bad, a full 60k tune up is not throwing parts it is listed in the 60k service points, cap/rotor/hv wire sets/ & plugs.
• EFI is bad. (the fueling side) injectors bad , 1/2 clogged or leaking. fuel pressure wrong. at idle and or WOT .
• MAP sensor bad. making ECU compute fueling wrong. for the vacuum hose to it is bad, clogged or cracked.
• ECT bad tells ECU that you live in Alaska, (reads wrong ohms for 72 degree temps before first start in the AM) FSm covers it.
• Any wiring bad to any of the above that has wires. if you still get DTC 24 the TPS is still failing for bad wires.

there are tests for each possible case using tools, meters (DMM) , fuel pressure gauge, compression gauge, etc)
more causes are CKP bad, (crank sensor is flaky , intermittent,)a gain wires.
the CMP in the Distributor , is inject to cam sync sensor, and if set wrong injections will be timed wrong and misfire it can.
The Distributor pulled then put back in now is TIMED wrong. every time. it must be done correctly ,by the book FSM (free)
95,,,,2.5L (usa spec car)

wires bad means the wire or the pins or corrosion see, cut wires smashed, wrecked, etc. or insultation missing and now shorts
other wrong things even to metal of the body or the engine, this is called damaged wires. electrics 101 stuff

I am not saying this is the only list, just top causes, (majors)

ok thank you.

 

[deadpool1]

I will check this out tonight/ tomorrow. if this is not done as you stated, will this increase the voltage to the TPS just asking? also will the CO2 sensor have

anything to do with the "mis Firing"? not getting any readings on replacing it but just asking.

I can not answer your question, about TPS you use the wrong names, ACC ? ASE?
the pins are named
ground pin 1, color black/light blue (BK/LB)
TPS output signal pin2 or in modern terms Throttle angle <<< nice name no? color (orange dark blue. OR/DB)
and 5vdc power pin3 , VT/WT violet /white wire. color. it is 5vdc at all time key on, +/-10% spec.
if it fails say what pin failed, and how measured (connections)


I can not see you uses your meter at the TPS, at all. if I did I'd have lots more to say,
there are 4 tests. I do at the TPS,(ask)

I have no idea what pins you tested nor how the meter was connected, at the test.
and if engine was key on not running or at idle.

Not told yet if engine MISFIRES at WOT
not told yet if new TPS cured the DTC error 24 or not.
to clear all DTC just pull the battery neg lug for 5min, this also causes ECU to recalibrate the TPS>.

wot = wide open throttle driving. for sure up hills oops sorry no hills in FL. so wot on flat ground and do so in all gears
up to 50 mph, full clean power delivery to the rear wheels at WOT.
I am still gathering evidence, I can not drive the car and learn all modes of driving the causes MISFIRE.


the o2 senser on all cars (front) can fail in many ways but here are these ways below. in brief.
The O2 sensor is offline at WOT, that is why I keep begging does it misfire WOT, (crickets)
O2 fails list:
it's bad and stuck at 0vdc out and the voltage never swings and its bad. ECU goes to MAX RICH fuel injection and sure can misfire. too rich for sure cars 1980 to 1995, old ECU. OBD2 cures some if the bad acts of OBD1. this is a fact.

1996 cars and up as less this effect. but 95 down are OBD1 and are more crude ECU.
the pin is called O2 CELL+ this is measured oxygen, (and works only in closed loop hot engine)
the 02 scan stick at a high voltage out if its internal heater shorts to the CELL+ output pin DTC 21, 51 or code 52 errors.
Just unplug the 02 like I told you to run the test. and tell if DTCs are still present, at every post. CEL glowing running means DTC are live or stored.
failure #2 the 02 sensor fails even replaced 10 times, due to the exhaust header, and pipe there is cracked or the header donut
gasket is cracked sucking in air, air is 20% oxygin so makes the 02 sensor lie like a dog. (it sticks at 0v and ECU goes max rich)

end 02 wonders. ( i have in my files photos my scope readings of every 02 sensor failing for all modes of failure)

 

[deadpool1]

if this is not done as you stated, will this increase the voltage to the TPS ? (seen where you forgot to say of 3 places)

no only the pin 2 will read wrong of the TPS was installed wrong.
wires good ground never fails
wires good +5v pin never fails key on, unless MAP shorts this wire , its shared. or wires shorted to ground or ECU is bad.
if 5v fails all techs know to unplug the TPS and map both see ECU 5vdc sources is good.
pin 2 fails (all other pins good) only if TPS is bad (no its now new) or it was installed wrong as my FSM page above shows. verbatum.

ask away , no need to say just saying , just ask any question ,all questions can be answered, (promptly or in time or with more tests) fixing cars is a serial process, test by test.
guessing can cause bad part to be added to the car and now has 2 problems

 

[CurtT]

I can not answer your question, about TPS you use the wrong names, ACC ? ASE?
the pins are named
ground pin 1, color black/light blue (BK/LB)
TPS output signal pin2 or in modern terms Throttle angle <<< nice name no? color (orange dark blue. OR/DB)
and 5vdc power pin3 , VT/WT violet /white wire. color. it is 5vdc at all time key on, +/-10% spec.
if it fails say what pin failed, and how measured (connections)


I can not see you uses your meter at the TPS, at all. if I did I'd have lots more to say,
there are 4 tests. I do at the TPS,(ask)

I have no idea what pins you tested nor how the meter was connected, at the test.
and if engine was key on not running or at idle.

Not told yet if engine MISFIRES at WOT
not told yet if new TPS cured the DTC error 24 or not.
to clear all DTC just pull the battery neg lug for 5min, this also causes ECU to recalibrate the TPS>.

wot = wide open throttle driving. for sure up hills oops sorry no hills in FL. so wot on flat ground and do so in all gears
up to 50 mph, full clean power delivery to the rear wheels at WOT.
I am still gathering evidence, I can not drive the car and learn all modes of driving the causes MISFIRE.


the o2 senser on all cars (front) can fail in many ways but here are these ways below. in brief.
The O2 sensor is offline at WOT, that is why I keep begging does it misfire WOT, (crickets)
O2 fails list:
it's bad and stuck at 0vdc out and the voltage never swings and its bad. ECU goes to MAX RICH fuel injection and sure can misfire. too rich for sure cars 1980 to 1995, old ECU. OBD2 cures some if the bad acts of OBD1. this is a fact.

1996 cars and up as less this effect. but 95 down are OBD1 and are more crude ECU.
the pin is called O2 CELL+ this is measured oxygen, (and works only in closed loop hot engine)
the 02 scan stick at a high voltage out if its internal heater shorts to the CELL+ output pin DTC 21, 51 or code 52 errors.
Just unplug the 02 like I told you to run the test. and tell if DTCs are still present, at every post. CEL glowing running means DTC are live or stored.
failure #2 the 02 sensor fails even replaced 10 times, due to the exhaust header, and pipe there is cracked or the header donut
gasket is cracked sucking in air, air is 20% oxygin so makes the 02 sensor lie like a dog. (it sticks at 0v and ECU goes max rich)

end 02 wonders. ( i have in my files photos my scope readings of every 02 sensor failing for all modes of failure)

I will try to correct my verbage for you to be correct. not a proper mechanic and will try to clean up for you to make us both understand better.

 

[deadpool1]

the TPS, is mounted in such a way the TPS is spring loaded to the shaft. (TV shaft)
this causes the TPS to track the TV shaft 100 % accuratly and not jam or be loose and sloppy !
put on wrongly, the TV jams I think before WOT. and is a super bad act that can wreck the TPS, at WOT moments.
okay. install it with full care, and attention to this detail and facts.
even put a new TPS with TB in hand so you can gently operate the TV and make sure the TPS works and does not JAM THE TV ever.

the TB throttle body is only an AIR VALVE
the TV means throttle valve ( a butterfly valve in pure mechanics.)
The TPS is only a THROTTLE Angle SENSOR and must not be loose or tell lies to the ECU.
the FSM even warns not to run the engine if the TPS was installed wrong but doing so can wreck any TPS .
it's only plastic, ,
most times only the wires are bad. to the TPS. or MAP wires bad or shorted or MAP 5vdc is shorting out a
and that makes the same wire to the TPS fail hard.
the TPS does not cause WOT misfire ever say 5 full seconds or more of WOT. does not.
the O2 sensors is offline WOT, so the O2 does not cause WOT misfire. as the O2 is OFFLINE in the driving mode.
this is why I beg for driving evidence. hot engine, cold engine, starting, idling and WOT.
yes the TPS bad can cause what is calleD TIP_IN Hesitation,
as the right foot toe TIPS in the throttle the power delays, called Hesitation. then self corrects in a few seconds and full power hits there rear wheels, At WOT. is this clear?
misfire means 1 to 4 cylinder misfire, or all do at once. 1996 cars tell you which one did, or all. your can can not do that test.
misfire is hear, felt and seen
so see misfire , the shiftl lever goes mad. shakes
or under hood I advance the throttle TV by hand and hear and see the engine shake voilently. misfire.

never ingore the CEL lamp it glows key and goes out running
if glows running, that means DTC are stored in ECU memory or means live DTC errors or both.
never egnore the CEL lamp it is your friend if glows running,
mostly OBD1 cars the DTC errors are mainly gross catastrophic errors, like dead this and dead that. and can never be ingored
okay? I do hope all this helps

EFI is complex this is not a bad desk lamp.
The EFI is a computer, and all inputs or outputs can fail and most times the ECU never fails.(caps do on some)
the inputs on this ECU are fully protected and never fail unless the sensor or wires did.
the outputs on any ECU this old are not protected, so you someone hot wires pins in a car, you blow up the ECU.
do not hot wire parts, in this car for sure any wire connected to any ECU pins, or BOOM you let the smoke out. as we say.
the starter sure. jumped sure.
jump start the battery sure.

all other hotwiring is NOT WISE.

The ECU does not measure fuel pressure ever, that is my job,
My FSM even warns of that fact.
the ECU does not know a spark plug shorted. (until 1996 use EPA laws)
it will see the HV spark coil primary shorted and ASD relay drop and EFI goes dead and engine stalls dead on purpose.
so the 60k tune up is a big thing here.for spark and filters.

I still have no idea how you did those TPS meter checks, not at all,
what pin jumps, not told
how the 2 meters leads connected not told
I wait.