Thinking of Deleting the Lift

redcardinal

redcardinal

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Aug 31, 2021
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Location
Fort Worth, TX
We like our Jeep. We purchased it to flat-tow behind our motor home. We replaced the poor old 4.0 with a reman and had the AX-15 transmission repaired at a local shop. The transfer case was recently repaired by the PO. After removing the the track bars the ride is much better.

We have "death wobble" around 45mph. Not a surprise considering the wear in the front and the lift. I have plans to replace everything replaceable and to delete the suspension lift. We're getting too old to have to climb into our ride. Most of the rest of the Jeep's existence will be following the motor home, street driving, and mild off-roading.

If memory serves, the PO said this had a 3 1/2" suspension lift,
IMG_7234.jpg

IMG_7238.jpg


and a 1" body lift.
IMG_7239.jpg


And I think the skid plate has been lowered.
IMG_7240.jpg


Also, on the front springs at the hanger, the spring on the left has a 1 1/4" bushing and the spring on the right has a 1 1/2" bushing, and it's reversed on the other end of the spring.
IMG_7235.jpg


Here's my questions for y'all:

1. Does it appear from the pics that my assumptions are correct about the lift?
2. Is deleting the suspension lift just a matter of sourcing stock springs and replacing them along with any necessary bushings and hardware?
3. Should the skid plate spacer go away also?
4. Did the PO install one of the front springs backward?

Thank you for your thoughts!
Randy
 
Yes, new stock springs would do the trick for back to stock and your assumptions seem right about the current lift. You'd like need new shorter shocks and smaller tires perhaps as well after lowering it,too bad as you have Bilstiens on it now which are good shocks. The skid drop can go by,by too. Im not a fan of body lifts myself but it can be left in place if you like. Too bad on the DW, I really cant recall on the spring bushing sizes end to end but It sound slike they may be incorrect and causing the DW if they are to small on one end. You say wear in the front?? if parts are worn out,tie rods,ball joints ect and bushings shot this will make for the DW issue.
 
Sounds like one of the front springs is possibly reversed (if I'm reading that correctly) This could create some problems. I believe the bigger bushings on my front springs are toward the rear. I would definitely flip the spring around (if it is indeed reversed).
If you want it lower. The cheapest way would be to remove the body lift. You might try that first and see if it's low enough. If you still want it lower, you could then install stock springs and shocks, nothing lost.
If you install stock springs, you will need to remove the skid plate spacer.
As for the "death wobble" I would check out the entire suspension, and all the steering components as well as the tires.
It may be as simple as worn steering/ suspension components and an unbalanced tire. (or a reversed spring??)
Or some combo. No reason a modestly lifted YJ should death wobble.

You might not need to replace EVERYTHING.

FWIW
-Russ
 
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Look for part numbers on the springs. If they are rough country springs, then the bushings are probably dead. They look like RC springs.

I doubt the spring is flipped because that would have required drilling a hole at some point and having a really loose bolt in the other hole. Possible I guess but worn bushings is far more common. If they are rough country springs then it’s almost guaranteed they are bad.

I would investigate the spring bushings and see if you can keep the springs but ditch that body lift. It feels tall right now because it is - but ditching the body lift would make a huge difference and you may be ok with it at that point.
 
Thanks for the responses everyone. I definitely plan to replace everything replaceable up front AND turn one of the springs around after I figure out which one is backward.
Can someone tell me how thick the body mount spacing should be or were stock? Ours are right at 3”.
 
redcardinal said:
Thanks for the responses everyone. I definitely plan to replace everything replaceable up front AND turn one of the springs around after I figure out which one is backward.
Can someone tell me how thick the body mount spacing should be or were stock? Ours are right at 3”.
Click to expand...
What makes you think a spring is backwards? It would be hard to install a spring backwards by accident....

body mounts are a rubber bushing sitting on top of the frame perch from the factory. In your pics above you don't even have that, it's like they replaced the rubber with the lift block which I imagine makes for a harsh vibey experience. Anywho, the rubber bushing is the only spacing of the body mount from the factory. Looks like someone installed a 3" body lift and ditched the rubber bushings.

I would ditch the body lift, install new body bushings, leave the suspension alone (i.e. not go back to stock, or at least try removing BL first), fix the DW (probably due to bad suspension bushings) and call it done.

Here is a pic of one of my body mounts. Mine is factory except for a 1.25" body lift. So you have the bolt, the rubber isolator that goes underneath, the rubber bushing that sits on top, that has a metal cup on top of it that the body sits on. My 1.25" body lift pucks sit on top of that and the body now sits on top of that puck. Originally, that 1.25" puck would be gone and the body would be sitting directly on top of the metal cup on top of the upper bushing.

IMG_3986.jpeg
 
The area that looks like a crack in the frame is from the undercoating coming off.

By a front spring being backward I mean that looking at the holes in the end of the spring where they mount to the shackle with a bushing, one spring has a 1 1/4" bushing hole at the front shackle and a 1 1/2" hole on the other end that mounts to the body. The other front spring has a 1 1/2" bushing hole at the front shackle and a 1 1/4" hole at the other end that mounts to the body. Surely this can't be correct, can it? In picture #5 from my original post you can maybe see that the spring shackles on the front end of the springs are different sizes. The one on the passenger side is 1 1/4" and on the drivers side it's 1 1/2".

From machoheadgames body lift picture it looks like I have to find new stock body mount parts to make it correct. And, yes, it has a very harsh ride. You can feel every pebble on the road. Lowering the tire pressure from the 38 psi that it had on all 4 corners when I brought it home to a more reasonable 28 psi helped quite a bit though.
 
redcardinal said:
By a front spring being backward I mean that looking at the holes in the end of the spring where they mount to the shackle with a bushing, one spring has a 1 1/4" bushing hole at the front shackle and a 1 1/2" hole on the other end that mounts to the body. The other front spring has a 1 1/2" bushing hole at the front shackle and a 1 1/4" hole at the other end that mounts to the body. Surely this can't be correct, can it? In picture #5 from my original post you can maybe see that the spring shackles on the front end of the springs are different sizes. The one on the passenger side is 1 1/4" and on the drivers side it's 1 1/2".
Click to expand...
Ok yes, I looked closer and I see the difference in spring eyes now. I'm still curious if you can find any branding written/painted onto the springs. That would help figure out what you have and how it's supposed to be installed. I'm wondering if your two front springs are even the same brand. I mean they definitely could have installed the spring backwards, but the bolt sizes front to rear are different. So the front bolts are 1/2", and the rear frame bolts are 9/16. In order to flip the spring, the 9/16 bolt would either have to go to the shackle end but the shackle would have to be drilled for that, or the sleeve in the spring bushing would need to be changed for the 9/16 bolt to go there.

If the springs use poly bushings, which the installer usually assembles themselves and inserts a sleeve after, then yeah I could see someone screwing that up. Just putting bushings and sleeves wherever and getting it all bolted up. Definitely deserves an inspection and replacement of all the mess you find.

redcardinal said:
From machoheadgames body lift picture it looks like I have to find new stock body mount parts to make it correct. And, yes, it has a very harsh ride. You can feel every pebble on the road. Lowering the tire pressure from the 38 psi that it had on all 4 corners when I brought it home to a more reasonable 28 psi helped quite a bit though.
Click to expand...
Yeah I imagine the way that body lift is now it must be making the ride pretty harsh. I don't know what your budget is but ditching the body lift to go with only simple body mounts, and going with a better quality 2.5" suspension is probably your best bet. It won't feel that tall to get into and would maintain decent looks with good handling and ride quality.
 
Dont cringe guys but I run my AT tires at 16 psi on my 91 all the time, cant even imagine how poorly it would ride at 35psi. . That includes a 65mph/65 mile run to the closest town of any significance. Been like that for a year or so. You might try energy suspension for stock type body mount kits. I do see OEM style mounts but all of them will get pretty pricey.
 
Okay. I've reversed one of the front springs to match the other and replaced everything replaceable, except for the anti-swaybar bushings which I forgot to order. They are available locally though. Changing out the parts didn't help the wobble issue or improve the ride in any way. But, I shouldn't have to do it again.

I replaced the steel wheels and tires all around with a set of tires on aluminum rims that were given to me. The new wheels have a much shallower dish so the track width narrowed by about 4 inches (2" on each side). I had the previous wheels/tires spin balanced by a local shop right after I purchased the Jeep, but after changing to the new setup, NO MORE DEATH WOBBLE!! And the ride is MUCH better with the aluminum wheels. I learned a long time ago that to make a vehicle ride better all you have to do is reduce the un-sprung weight. Since this Jeep will spend most of it's remaining life with us on the street, mild trails, or being towed, the aluminum wheels shouldn't be a problem.

I've ordered a stock body mount kit 3 times from different major vendors in the last 3 weeks. It is interesting how vendors will show an item in stock, accept payment online, then days later when it's time to ship realize the don't have any in stock and offer to refund your money in 7-10 business days. It appears that the last order, from Jegs, has actually shipped today. I should have ordered from them first I guess.

I'll post again with pictures after I get the body mounts changed to what they should be.
 
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